Srila Prabhupada ist still alive in His Books in His Pictures.
@ramakisoradasa5814 In which shastra is there a provision for a global GBC? None. Its is Srila Bhaktisiddanta Saraswati Thakur's contribution, which Srila Prabhupada has subscribed to and it is followed in ISKCON too. Acharyas orders are shastras themselves. Let's not be selective and folllow what suits our agenda.
The Iskcon gurus today act as ritviks whether they admit it or not. They all say chant 16 rounds, follow 4 regulations, read Srila Prabhupada's and follow his instruction. The real reason the living guru system is so adamantly advocated by Iskcon is because it provides power, money and control, not out of altruistic spiritual concerns. Anyone who has read Prabhupada's books and understands the science of self realization will know that mundane physicality is not at all necessary for spiritual development.
@nofugz8939 I think you are unable to keep up with the dialectic hence claiming strawman! Let me break it down for you,
1. Did Prabhupada enforce a post-samadhi ritvik system?
Ans: Srila Prabhupada ordered (did not enforce - might carry a negative connotation) for a ritvik representatives' system going forward for the initiation process without any reservations like ifs, buts, etc. There are clear evidences such as the May 28th conversation, July 7th Conversation, October 16th conversation. The ultimate declaration of July 9th 1977 stands tall with clear and concise methods of how the initiation process will carry on. Srila Prabhupada's will third section acts as a backup to this mentioning how the next gen executives and representatives will be appointed.
2. Is editing Prabhupada's books correct? - is a DIFFERENT topic, hardly even related.
Ans: It is highly relevant because that stands as an live example of how there have been attempts made to adulterate and alter the philosophy to align with their agenda. We have seen this time and again how during the early centuries the Mughals did this to Vedic scriptures then the British colonisers and now this. Scriptures are the basis for any philosophical and theological details to be explored and if you have control over the books that propagate these its at an impasse and over time becomes the truth.
Looks like the real strawman is YOU! You have zero evidences of any claim that you are making it is purely based on speculation and your "beliefs". Hence a evidenced, non-speculative and uncommon order of Srila Prabhupada is incomprehensible. So you prefer the steelman arguement of ritvik over the strawman self-appointed guru system.
Your cognitive dissonance is apparent when you talk about the edits made to Srila Prabhupada's books this is either to manipulate neophytes or your inability to face the truth against your so-called beliefs. The change in your ideology is apparently masked by the earlier weak foundations leading you into an infinite regress. Hopefully your reading of Srila Prabhupada's original books and listening to lectures will end this.
Lastly, your adherence to "physical guru", "living guru", is a concept fabricated by the guru system to further their business. Quote one verse from any scripture where a guru is considered dead and gone once he departs from this material world. This is against our Krishna Consciousness philosophy. This line of argument will lead to questioning the authenticity of the philosophy altogether. When we sing in the Guru puja - sāksād-dharitvena - The Spiritual Master is described as the representative of the Supreme Personality of Godhead. So if Lord Sri Krishna can reciprocate to our prayers through deities, photographs, and through a postcard, then Srila Prabhupada as a representative of Lord Sri Krishna can accept disciples through deity form, photo form or postcard form if required. Let's not limit Srila Prabhupada to our level of understanding just because your common sense is capped!
Hope this helps to look at Srila Prabhupada as more than a deity and take His Divine Grace's shelter. Jai Srila Prabhupada! Hare Krishna.
The Iskcon gurus today act as ritviks whether they admit it or not. They all say chant 16 rounds, follow 4 regulations, read Srila Prabhupada's and follow his instruction. The real reason the living guru system is so adamantly advocated by Iskcon is because it provides power, money and control, not out of altruistic spiritual concerns. Anyone who has read Prabhupada's books and understands the science of self realization will know that mundane physicality is not at all necessary for spiritual development.
@nofugz8939 There are more than 5000 edits in the Bhagavad-Gita As it is from the original 1972 McMillan edition to the current versions and the original editions are nowhere accessible in the temples under the ISKCON guru system how is that fair? Inaccessibility of the founder acharya's version of the book in his own organisation? What are the reasons justifying for such extensive revisions?
Which excerpts are excessively extrapolated or exaggerated to match the ritvik philosophy can you please share?
The Iskcon gurus today act as ritviks whether they admit it or not. They all say chant 16 rounds, follow 4 regulations, read Srila Prabhupada's and follow his instruction. The real reason the living guru system is so adamantly advocated by Iskcon is because it provides power, money and control, not out of altruistic spiritual concerns. Anyone who has read Prabhupada's books and understands the science of self realization will know that mundane physicality is not at all necessary for spiritual development.
@TaruṇaGovindaDāsaWe all know the 'living guru' doesn't micromanage his devotees he just redirects them to a siksha guru essentially you're following the ritvik system but denying Srila Prabhupada and taking up to self-appointed gurus. You need the best of luck!
The Iskcon gurus today act as ritviks whether they admit it or not. They all say chant 16 rounds, follow 4 regulations, read Srila Prabhupada's and follow his instruction. The real reason the living guru system is so adamantly advocated by Iskcon is because it provides power, money and control, not out of altruistic spiritual concerns. Anyone who has read Prabhupada's books and understands the science of self realization will know that mundane physicality is not at all necessary for spiritual development.
@nofugz8939 Srila Prabhupada also mentioned not to edit his books or make any fundamental changes but, those were made to align with their agendas who authorised these actions? Definitely not Prabhupada
BHAKTI SIDDHANT SARASWATI WRITES IN 'TRUE CONCEPTION OF SRI GURU TATTVA' AS FOLLOWES:
"This line of guru-parampara is existing up to today without any break and it will continue to exist like this in the future also. To say 'there is no bonafide Guru living in the world at present and neither will there be any in the future,' is an atheistic opinion."
@DD-su5ht Srila Prabhupada's deities existed even when HDG was present in this material world and Srila Prabhupada approved of this - Read the conversation between Srila Prabhupada and Sampat Kumar Bhattacharya.
It is the self-appointed Gurus and their followers always trying to replace Srila Prabhupada to be a mere observer when they take all the credits and enjoy it. Even lip-service to Srila Prabhupada by glorifying him as Jagadguru is banned in your ISKCON by the law book. We were ready to give up all our temples to integrate the movement and serve together only if Srila Prabhupada was accepted as the Spiritual Master of the whole of ISKCON which he is! This shows who the real cheaters are.
1. Did Prabhupada enforce a post-samadhi ritvik system?
Ans: Srila Prabhupada ordered (did not enforce - might carry a negative connotation) for a ritvik representatives' system going forward for the initiation process without any reservations like ifs, buts, etc. There are clear evidences such as the May 28th conversation, July 7th Conversation, October 16th conversation. The ultimate declaration of July 9th 1977 stands tall with clear and concise methods of how the initiation process will carry on. Srila Prabhupada's will third section acts as a backup to this mentioning how the next gen executives and representatives will be appointed.
2. Is editing Prabhupada's books correct? - is a DIFFERENT topic, hardly even related.
Ans: It is highly relevant because that stands as an live example of how there have been attempts made to adulterate and alter the philosophy to align with their agenda. We have seen this time and again how during the early centuries the Mughals did this to Vedic scriptures then the British colonisers and now this. Scriptures are the basis for any philosophical and theological details to be explored and if you have control over the books that propagate these its at an impasse and over time becomes the truth.
Looks like the real strawman is YOU! You have zero evidences of any claim that you are making it is purely based on speculation and your "beliefs". Hence a evidenced, non-speculative and uncommon order of Srila Prabhupada is incomprehensible. So you prefer the steelman arguement of ritvik over the strawman self-appointed guru system.
Your cognitive dissonance is apparent when you talk about the edits made to Srila Prabhupada's books this is either to manipulate neophytes or your inability to face the truth against your so-called beliefs. The change in your ideology is apparently masked by the earlier weak foundations leading you into an infinite regress. Hopefully your reading of Srila Prabhupada's original books and listening to lectures will end this.
Lastly, your adherence to "physical guru", "living guru", is a concept fabricated by the guru system to further their business. Quote one verse from any scripture where a guru is considered dead and gone once he departs from this material world. This is against our Krishna Consciousness philosophy. This line of argument will lead to questioning the authenticity of the philosophy altogether. When we sing in the Guru puja - sāksād-dharitvena - The Spiritual Master is described as the representative of the Supreme Personality of Godhead. So if Lord Sri Krishna can reciprocate to our prayers through deities, photographs, and through a postcard, then Srila Prabhupada as a representative of Lord Sri Krishna can accept disciples through deity form, photo form or postcard form if required. Let's not limit Srila Prabhupada to our level of understanding just because your common sense is capped!
Hope this helps to look at Srila Prabhupada as more than a deity and take His Divine Grace's shelter. Jai Srila Prabhupada! Hare Krishna.
Which excerpts are excessively extrapolated or exaggerated to match the ritvik philosophy can you please share?
"This line of guru-parampara is existing up to today without any break and it will continue to exist like this in the future also. To say 'there is no bonafide Guru living in the world at present and neither will there be any in the future,' is an atheistic opinion."
It is the self-appointed Gurus and their followers always trying to replace Srila Prabhupada to be a mere observer when they take all the credits and enjoy it. Even lip-service to Srila Prabhupada by glorifying him as Jagadguru is banned in your ISKCON by the law book. We were ready to give up all our temples to integrate the movement and serve together only if Srila Prabhupada was accepted as the Spiritual Master of the whole of ISKCON which he is! This shows who the real cheaters are.